1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Complains and suggestions about the site (come from the logo)

Discussion in 'Announcements and suggestions' started by Northerner, Jan 30, 2018.

  1. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Somewhere else more democratic
    Well if I was running something and there was a contentious thread I would spare a couple of minutes to check it more than once every 4 days but that’s me. And if I’d alienated two mods sufficiently for them to quit I’d at least have thanked them for their input during their years of volunteering doing a tricky job. Buts that’s just me.

    We all have our own management style and yours seems to be very direct at times and very hands off at others.

    I can see a thread going south very quickly with no moderators at all...think you might need to recruit some, but it’s up to you, your website :)
     
    Machaneus, T-ster and samovar like this.
  2. T-ster

    T-ster Moderator Staff Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    933
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    England
    Still one moderator here and i check the thread daily i have just had very little to add. For what its worth Northerner is the most easy going, non confrontational member and a proper gent, for him to have opinions on this board i consider them very valid. For the most part i agree with everything he has said.

    People need to separate opinion and concern from warring/trolling/fighting. I have seen lots of what i consider important members with important concerns voicing them, this is not a bad thing and should not be discouraged. The passion these members have for this board means that when they have concerns they should be addressed.

    I will do whatever i can to help here but I also fear the boombox side is in irrecoverable decline but we shall see.
     
    Command8, Ball000, samovar and 3 others like this.
  3. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Somewhere else more democratic
    Wow, way to forget about someone...that’s how much a moderator is valued...leave and there’s silence, stay and you’re forgotten...oops
     
    Ball000 and samovar like this.
  4. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Somewhere else more democratic
    And yes as Tre says, I hate arguments and confrontation away from work (life’s too short) so I’m expressing my opinions on this because I think the forum is heading downhill rapidly and I’ve put enough years of input into this place on the boombox side for it to bother me...the Walkman people won’t know me from Adam but I’m not some noob sticking their nose in for fun
     
    Machaneus and samovar like this.
  5. PHILIP[

    PHILIP[ Member

    Messages:
    104
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Birkenhead
    Why cant we just close this thread until everyone has calmed down
     
  6. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Somewhere else more democratic
    I’m sorry but who isn’t calm?...I’m Mr Calm. And I’m not sure that’s a healthy way to deal with mild conflict...censor it?
     
  7. Michelle Knight

    Michelle Knight Active Member

    Messages:
    196
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Sussex, UK
    I have to admit, that I still can't figure out how this became two sides. I like walkman and boomboxes. I've been reading both, although I unfortunately had to recycle my last boombox a few weeks before discovering the forum. By that time, I'd tried to fix it so much, that it was well and truly broken beyond repair. Had it for about thirty years, if memory serves, but I could be wrong. Probably still have the receipt here somewhere.

    Actually, it was May last year. Ouch. Many months before discovering the forum.
    Screenshot at 2018-02-13 20-09-00.png

    Downhill... uphill... it sounds like there's been a lot of change here... sure... but it sounds to me like the people here at least have the chance to continue forward. Forums are, after all, what people make of them. Are they not?
     
    Longman and Ball000 like this.
  8. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Somewhere else more democratic
    Yep you’re absolutely right...a forum is only as good as the community who contribute to it. Disrespect them and not value them and they leave as has been seen...all that remains after that is a worthless web address
     
  9. Michelle Knight

    Michelle Knight Active Member

    Messages:
    196
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Sussex, UK
    It does seem that there have always been disagreements on the forum...

    Screenshot at 2018-02-13 20-22-12.png
     
    Northerner likes this.
  10. Michelle Knight

    Michelle Knight Active Member

    Messages:
    196
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Sussex, UK
    ... that was posted after ao had a bit of a ding dong with radio.raheem in late 2012 over the sound of the kaboom.
     
    isolator42 and Northerner like this.
  11. Michelle Knight

    Michelle Knight Active Member

    Messages:
    196
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    Sussex, UK
    Just because you can't see it, doesn't mean that it isn't being worked on. I've put a fair chunk of my spare time to this work in the last few weeks, and comments like this aren't very nice. I PM'd Deech a few days ago concerning the old forum. When people do these things in their spare time... it takes time. It isn't number one priority. Be patient, it's coming. And tonight is pub night, when I go to my local and have a few jars... so I won't be slaving over a keyboard tonight either.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 14, 2018
    Command8 likes this.
  12. T-ster

    T-ster Moderator Staff Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    933
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    England
    Ok, lets thank Michelle for the ongoing database work and keep in mind why we are here. Logo related comments are fine and peoples views are fine but we dont need any melodrama.
     
  13. walkman archive

    walkman archive Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,152
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Barcelona
    I agree with you. I have a mortgage, two kids a wife and a job. Also me and my wife are both self employed, and in my country that means you have less help and more bills.
    And everyone of these things are way more important than my walkmans, my hobbies and this forum. I think everyone should keep looking at the problem inside a wide angle lens.
    I'll try to reply everyone correctly, and also try to use the proper words because I think my words are taken and being analyzed with a loupe.

    You're right, Northerner.

    @Nickfish, @deech : I'd like to publicly thank your efforts and help to the community, both as moderators and as users. I respect your decision although I don't fully understand it.

    Tre, my excuses. too many comments and things happened and I forgot about you. I'll edit my comment.

    I'm not sure if you're saying I disrespect anyone, but just in case, I didn't.

    Let me sum up the late story of the forum so we can understand the situation (chronological order):
    • 2016: The old forum was about to be shut down by Paul, original founder. No information will be kept. ALL will be lost. Forever. May I remember that this could be the 2nd time all information will be lost, because in 2007 there was another migration and ALL was indeed lost.
    • I took the decision to get the wheel and drive it, together with 3 friends. We initially kept the platform.
    • Ok, too expensive to keep it and also it's a SAS (software as service), that means we have nothing. They have all.
    • We decide to switch to our own server.
    • Migrating the old info isn't possible. At least easily.
    • Migrating will cost around 4000$. Absolutely no way me and my friends will pay that.
    • We, however, paid 300$+ to keep a copy of the DB for the future. No one knows when we could merge it with the new one, but at least we have a copy of it. (it would be lost if Paul simply closed the forum).
    • We set up the new forum. All works fine.
    • Forum structure replicated and optimized. Boomboxes keep staying on top (top first 6 forums are about them!)
    • New header and "logo" (although that was not really a logo, but a simple text). Some didn't like it. It's ok, but I didn't found the time and energy to make a new one.
    • More than 10.000 posts added to a new tab 'Old threads'. fully browseable and with quick search.
    • docs offered his help to work on the DB, but he finally didn't sucess.
    ... fast forward until today (about one year)
    • New header and logo after months of thinking about it (some that didn't like it now seem to like it)
    • Michelle starts working on the DB and she's doing great impovements. I bet in very few days we will have something nice to announce, although it's not the old DB merged with the actual one.
    There are still complains and threats about the old DB, and what I can say is that I won't pay from my pocket such amount of money to recover it. No way. I already said in one or two times. (Unless the donations skyrocket and we get such money, which is not the case actually).

    By the way, I'd like to warmly thank all members that have contributed with donations in this time. Without them, paying for the backup of the old DB could have been harder. Their contributions have been a great help to keep this alive.
    Every user here should know that hosting here the photos and other documents and videos highly increases the monthly bill. Reason why the vast majority of the forums don't host them, so people use external services.

    So, in my opinion, as a forum user I simply would like:
    • A good forum structure
    • Nice people and community
    • A not-so-bad platform that let's me interact with others.
    • Absence of trolls and spammers.
    As an old Stereo2go user I'd like:
    • To be able to read old posts.
    • To have the old DB merged with the new one.
    And these ones are a plus (welcomed but not absolutely necesary):
    • Modern platform, CSS3, mobile and tablet compatible
    • Fast server
    • Self storage for images, documents and even videos. No need to use photobucket and all that.
    • Nice header and icons.
    • Readable from RSS readers
    • Upgradeable with plug-ins to get more functionality
    Let's see what you got:

    Everything, except the old DB merged.

    Again: Everything, except the old DB merged.

    So, what do you guys want? (I'm telling this to the ones that complained about the forum) You got every one of the features!
    Please don't repeat about merging the DB again. What cannot be done, cannot be done. As easy as that. If one day we receive anough money from donations, I'll use it for that.
    Every euro and dollar we're receiving from donations is absolutely kept to use for S2G, in a special paypal account that is only for that. But sadly we're far from getting such big amount.

    Michelle is working on the old DB but we won't be merging it anytime soon unless we found someone that can help us. And bill us with a way cheaper price that we can afford.

    PS: No, I won't be closing this thread if we can talk under respect to each other. I never closed a thread. I won't censure comments that I don't like unless they go though insults or disrespect. But is true that this discussion has gone by the tangent because I was just asking if you liked the header or not.
     
    Ball000 and Michelle Knight like this.
  14. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Somewhere else more democratic
    Well done for stepping up and acknowledging the mods input and apologising to Tre for forgetting him. Respect for that.

    I agree, it’s great that you and others saved the forum from closure, I think everyone, including me, is grateful for that.

    However, disrespect absolutely was dished out and just saying you didn’t doesn’t make it so. It’s like the old preface to a statement “no offence but...” when they’re going to make an offensive comment...it doesn’t make it not offensive. You’ve made repeated comments along the lines of “it’s my forum I’ll do what I like”...you own the website, not the forum. It’s like a kid given a new ball who then thinks he owns the whole football game.

    To be honest, I think I’ve said my piece and am getting a bit boring so I’ll shut up and accept that whatever will happen will happen
     
  15. walkman archive

    walkman archive Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,152
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Barcelona
    Northerner, keeping the old platform was not an option. Yes, we could keep it for a year or two. Even more. But it was clear that we won't be using it forever. It was a closed platform. The design was ugly (at least IMHO and many other users) and was not customizable.
    And we didn't have anything: no DB, not even a single file, no nothing. If one day those guys decide to close their offices, we'd lost all.

    So the question was not if we will switch to another platform or not, but when will we switch.

    Once it was crystal-clear that sooner or later we will leave that bad platform, it made no sense to keep one day more on it. It will be money thrown out. If we had to keep there, we would have closed it sooner or later. So our main goal is to keep it alive, and switching was a must, not our desire.
    In fact, switching was hard and I had to spend personally almost four entire days working on it until I got it working. It would be much easier for me to use those days for my own stuff instead on using it for other's enjoyment.

    So, the question you may ask is: what did you prefer? Keep into the old platform for a year, maybe two, with no long-term future? Or switch to another, keep it alive and then we'll see how we can recover all the old DB?

    And we must not forget that you have 10.000+ post available in one of the tabs at the top of this very page. Right now, 10.000 posts. Hey, it's not 100 or 300 posts...
    I bet 95% of the old forum is right here.

    So in the end, we're still alive and the community is growing, and you may remember that since the switch in 2007 to Hoop.la S2G hasn't stopped to loose members day by day. don't you remember the many times repeated comments about how bad, ugly (and don't remember how many more bad things) were said about it?
    This platform is future-proof, because whenever we want to switch to another one, we can EASILY migrate ALL the info into it, because it has embedded tools to export-import to other platforms.

    And I'm bored of discussing this again and again. Lots of things has been said in this thread and I even had time to read them all. I have few free time every day and there are more important things that I must take care of, but here I am, trying to explain why am I doing what I am doing and giving you reasons to believe that this forum is great, even with the old DB frozen in time.
    I cannot do more. As if this were a pub, you can come and enjoy together with all of us, but please stop complaining about the things that you don't like. We do our best. We cannot do more. And if we could, we'll do.

    I hope this clarifies all the situation and serves as a end for this thread.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2018 at 1:13 PM
  16. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member S2G Supporter

    Messages:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Somewhere else more democratic
    I’ve never said anything about the platform so I’m not sure why you’re fixating on this. I don’t really care about the platform. I care about the atmosphere of the forum. You yet again make it clear that it’s your forum, you’ll do what you like, and you don’t care at all what anyone else thinks or wants. Hugo you are simply a tinpot dictator and someone I don’t wish to support and so after many years of supporting and contributing to this forum I shall join the increasing numbers of those who, by your attitude, have been encouraged to desert this place. I still wish the forum well but fear that with you as supreme leader it’s doomed to fail. I realise you won’t care even slightly that I, with the others, have left and this sadly is part of the problem. I’ll see them all on Boomboxery anyway which continues to go from strength to strength and supports it’s members in a friendly and democratic way. So with regret I bow out.
     
  17. autoreverser

    autoreverser Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    574
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Europe
    folks, this is the first (and will be the only time ) i get involved here.

    i haven't read all messages of this poll, also not all from that one discussing the "new" logo.

    beeing a real child of the Walkman-generation (born '67), ever since a collector of all kinda vintage audio-gear, cassette- lover and s2go-member since 1999 (starting with "pocketcalculatorshow.com") i can report my experiance and opinion to you as following :old::

    while good old paul was running it, there was first the Walkman- collectors, the Boombox- collectors joined a bit later and yes, those two "departements" have allways been a little different but there has never been a battle.
    i registered, because i was a Walkman- collector only and bbx's were far beyond my interest.
    there was this prejustice that a boombox is a crappy bunch of plastic, cheap chrome, underdimensioned powersupplies, insufficent amps and speakers, lousy sound, flimsy little buttons and levers wich break off when you look at'em, yawly cassette-decks (tape-salad-creators), blinky lights and vu's - all far away from beeing a proper device to reproduce high-fidelity (now i know i've allways been right - that's what they are, and that's what i love them for :nodding: ), but met so many nice people thru this platform, some i met in person and became (very) close friends - some of'em don't give a dime for a Walkman, some other's would never show up in public with a boombox - it all became a thing for the people, the units became side-effect.
    and when i'm honest: a Walkman (or similar) is generally the same: far away from beeing the perfect reproduction. reminder: those units didn't come out of a scientific process to find out the best way for audio-reproduction, nope, the Walkman (even more than a boombox) was a construct under a 100% commercial requirement - the idea was to insist a whole generation that it couldn't live without carrying their music around (i don't even know if the creators ever thought it would become such a success !). so i resume: what is the difference between those types of portable cassette-noodlers ? yay, speaker(s) built in or not - so it's two versions of entertainment: Walkman for the introverted - bbx's for the extroverted - am i right ? i think sort off :bigthumbsup: and yes, talking with the "other side"(bbx) started my interest in boomboxes. now i own quite a few - and won't miss'em.

    historically the "Walkman" came after the boombox - as the VCR came after Super8-movies, the scanner after the Xerox, the iPhone came after the cell-phone etc. etc., but they've got one thing in common:
    both kinds of units served their owners to supply their owners with that music they wanted - in form of prerecorded tapes, home recorded tapes or mixtapes from friends or the local famous dj or whatever.

    there were (in those days) folks wich never liked Walkmen because they were "anti-comunicative" because the user was deaf to his/her surrounding other folks never liked boomboxes because their owner forced their surrounding to be exposed to their personal musical taste, but there was also the ones liking both types and used their personal stereo occasionally - f.ex. Walkman in the school-bus and boombox on the beach - for myselfe i still identify with both, Walkmen and boomboxes, as they're my generation.

    and i think that is what we should use this platform for - to show off our collections, to ask for help, to help, to discuss all this electronic junk and what we play on it, to share our "lifestyle" etc.etc.

    for those who know me in person i allways hated the (so called) "social-medias" like facebook, i don't want to share and discuss my life in the "worldwidefookingweb" with people i don't know, i prefer tho discuss selected parts in the web only, but with people of my choice. those folks are all you guys here - i can avoid the ones i don't like so much and get on closer with other ones...

    well, long stories - paul decided to discontinue, so luckily with Hugo (here vicarious mentioned for all the other staff as well !) took over - and well, i also know Hugo here for ages - now his preferences (if i'm right) hasn't been so much about the "Walkman/Boombox-lifestyle", he's a technic- freak ! there's not many recording- processes onto cassette or r-2-r that he hasn't scientifically worked out and perfectioned to the limit of magnetic recording, he sees the high-tech Walkman with the same eyes as a watch collector sees a chronometer with infinite complications (...and that's what f.ex. a WM-701c is !), so i think it's absolutely wrong to start here any discussions or become personal offensive because the one or other member doesn't see her/his preferences mentioned enough or the visual appearance of this platform in the wrong way - Hugo (and the other staff !) is (are) putting a lot of effort and heart-blood in running this site, it takes a lot of his (their) private time running this and after all this platform is not commercial, means they do it on benefit (!!!) my advice: take it as it is, create new polls, new threads, post pics, share your enthusiasm, show off your gems, let us know what's your most wanted and threaten us with your musical taste, show your house, car, boat or whatever - carefully educate the moderators into your (the right :ok) direction.

    i want to carry on using this platform as i think it's one of the onliest places where i can find understanding and sympathy for my unusual hobby :bestfriends:

    staff: you folks do a great job, carry on, keep this platform running - i know you can't make it right for everybody but please try :biggrin:

    thanks for reading,
    c
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2018 at 5:53 AM
    Jorge, Command8 and T-ster like this.
  18. walkman archive

    walkman archive Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,152
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Barcelona
    @Northerner , I read your answer two days ago but I didn't have the desire or the energy to answer you.

    I don't want to write an extensive answer, because I think that almost everything has been said. I really didn't expect this comment coming from you.

    I just want to tell you a few things: you say you run a charity place. Then you will surely know very well that what really matters is deeds and not words. I'm sure you've seen a lot of cases of people promising you help but then you don't see them again. Facts, not words.

    Now I'd like you to forget the words and think about the facts in this forum. Then, draw your own conclusions.

    You say Boomboxery and other forums are based on democratic functioning. OK, prove it and I'll believe it. But remember: deeds, not words.

    I don't think I deserve your insults at all. With them you have lost your right to belong to this community. I'm very sad after reading your words, but you leave me no choice.

    Without knowing me or having seen me even once in your life, you are judging me, whereas I have never judged anyone here. I have been able to criticize a person for his words or his deeds, but I have not said "you are a...".

    If you haven't seen the movie 'Crash' (2004), I think you should; you'll learn that you can't judge people easily.
    And I don't think I have anything else to say.

    @autoreverser : Thank you for your words. I think you are quite right and I didn't know you were a member of this community since the last century! No doubt, you must be one of the oldest members of the community.
    In fact, in the forums you always find people you connect with more or less, so we simply try to get closer to the ones we think are most interesting and avoid those you don't, but in any case we enjoy the platforms to communicate. There is no such thing as a "good atmosphere" or "bad atmosphere" because we are not physically together and everyone's perception can be completely different. The only thing that really exists is a platform that works better or worse, and a certain amount of information that has been recorded. The rest are personal impressions of each other.

    If anyone has anything really interesting and worth to say, please post it. Otherwise, I'll close this thread in 24-48h.
     
    Jorge and autoreverser like this.
  19. Jorge

    Jorge Active Member

    Messages:
    490
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Malibu, CA
    I got an idea: delete this thread! :idea:

    ........................................................................................................

    Let me try again: PLEASE, delete this thread! :beg
     
    autoreverser likes this.
  20. walkman archive

    walkman archive Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,152
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Barcelona
    Doesn't sound as a bad idea; let me think what to do...
     

Share This Page